tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post985833360212810398..comments2024-03-29T05:47:10.437-07:00Comments on <em>Archimago's Musings</em>: MEASUREMENTS: Do power cables make a difference with audio amplifiers?Archimagohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08642574001287787545noreply@blogger.comBlogger87125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-74901747637502767872023-11-23T13:20:20.310-08:002023-11-23T13:20:20.310-08:00I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. Whil...I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. While i dont believe in megabuck power cables that make a difference, from my experience certain amplifiers work better with certain type of cable and i will give an example here. I have a Harman Kardon hk 990 which can put out 300w into 4 ohm therefore a relatively powerful beast. It came with is own power cable which while is not audiophile materialFornettihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08459999752109367116noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-91217953444808378322023-09-13T16:40:24.654-07:002023-09-13T16:40:24.654-07:00I'm with you on the cable skepticism, but I ca...I'm with you on the cable skepticism, but I can't help but be curious about power cables. Your article makes some valid points, and I appreciate your measured approach to the topic. It's essential to sift through the marketing hype and get to the facts. However, I've had a few friends rave about how changing their power cables made a difference in their audio setup, so I'm Zabhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16817050474722108287noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-72171113862866129532022-01-25T18:23:03.583-08:002022-01-25T18:23:03.583-08:00I disagree Bas,
Assuming we're not using some ...I disagree <em>Bas</em>,<br />Assuming we're not using some horrible thin wire unable to carry the current needs, reasonable length of cable, and using adequate connectors, then no, I have never heard <em>power cable</em> differences with amps or DACs.<br /><br />I think that's pretty normal and the expected outcome as well... I have never seen any controlled listening test to show Archimagohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08642574001287787545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-35584835855932985372022-01-25T17:19:57.657-08:002022-01-25T17:19:57.657-08:00I'm a little surprised that you've never h...I'm a little surprised that you've never heard a difference between cables. If you want to hear something REALLY obvious try comparing a multistrand cable with a solid core cable. If you can't hear a difference between those then one or other of us is either deaf or mad as a bicycle!Bashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02666931276623214818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-52356293400814356342022-01-22T09:00:40.322-08:002022-01-22T09:00:40.322-08:00Hi Mourningstar,
Yeah, when it comes to impulse-re...Hi <em>Mourningstar</em>,<br />Yeah, when it comes to impulse-related measurements, yeah I suppose we could look at that. However, note that the TIM test signal is very much a reflection of quality of transients. The fact that it's good tells us something very important!<br /><br />As for known cables, sure, will see about borrowing some ;-).Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-67881406043002572672022-01-22T08:57:25.844-08:002022-01-22T08:57:25.844-08:00Much of the crap removed ;-).
Much of the crap removed ;-).<br />Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-38221285360996285442022-01-22T08:57:08.949-08:002022-01-22T08:57:08.949-08:00Hi Mschut70,
I don't think they're necessa...Hi <em>Mschut70</em>,<br />I don't think they're necessary. I'd love to see test results proving that they improve sound quality as well!Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-46282130417244345642022-01-22T08:56:01.537-08:002022-01-22T08:56:01.537-08:00Hi schnesim,
Most of this is dealing with speaker ...Hi <em>schnesim</em>,<br />Most of this is dealing with speaker cables which we discussed here:<br />http://archimago.blogspot.com/2020/02/measurements-archimagos-colorful.html<br /><br />Yes, resistance, capacitance, inductance all have an effect and stuff like skin effect do happen. The key is in the details and not to be too impressed by small effects somehow translating to massive significantArchimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-6254304383198870552022-01-22T08:46:29.257-08:002022-01-22T08:46:29.257-08:00Hi Bas,
No, there was no difference in audibility....Hi <em>Bas</em>,<br />No, there was no difference in audibility. I had a quick listen later on after the testing in the soundroom. But then again, I don't believe I've <em>ever</em> heard a difference between a decent power cable and an upscale one even in demos at audio shows when the salesman does his thing to convince folks to listen to this and that!<br /><br />Theoretically, even if Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-49463326130177355052022-01-22T08:39:29.413-08:002022-01-22T08:39:29.413-08:00Right,
Shunyata with their DTCD stuff. Sure, curre...Right,<br />Shunyata with their DTCD stuff. Sure, current delivery can change with different wire gauges and geometry.<br /><br />Notice on that page, those graphs are low resolution. We can see the graphs in better detail in the video. For the "Black Mamba CX" vs. "Venom 3" graph the Y axis is <em>Amps</em> going from 0-225 or so, and the X-axis is <em>μs</em> (see 4:38 in Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-57998625450197929542022-01-22T08:25:25.141-08:002022-01-22T08:25:25.141-08:00Yes Unknown,
Skin effect can happen with AC and we...Yes <em>Unknown</em>,<br />Skin effect can happen with AC and we've talked about this with speaker cables:<br />http://archimago.blogspot.com/2020/02/measurements-archimagos-colorful.html<br /><br />While present, skin effect to 20kHz isn't really going to change the signal with the magnitude of claimed significant sonic difference that some companies and audiophiles will speak of.<br /><Archimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-4192496588476971902022-01-22T08:21:08.182-08:002022-01-22T08:21:08.182-08:00Indeed jlinkels,
There has been much nonsense out ...Indeed <em>jlinkels</em>,<br />There has been much nonsense out there about power cable hasn't there!?<br /><br />Synergistic Research advises buyers to plug the power cable into the wall <em>for one week</em> before even turning their system on for listening!!! This supposedly "settles" the system or something crazy like that.<br /><br />See the clownish sales video on this page atArchimago's Musingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14326929293463498820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-22265642605837200232022-01-21T07:48:46.912-08:002022-01-21T07:48:46.912-08:00Forgive me if I missed it - but I didn't notic...Forgive me if I missed it - but I didn't notice you saying whether you could hear any difference between the two cables you were testing. Or is that an unsatisfactory way of telling how audio cables sound? It seems to me that if you can't hear the difference between two cables then there is no point in measuring the differences.Bashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18127706719159003490noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-79124342953066791432021-12-25T03:13:34.561-08:002021-12-25T03:13:34.561-08:00https://shunyata.com/technology/https://shunyata.com/technology/Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539399173977034039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-24818463889988700242021-12-25T03:10:47.177-08:002021-12-25T03:10:47.177-08:00https://homeaudio.analysis.plus/knowledge-base/https://homeaudio.analysis.plus/knowledge-base/Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539399173977034039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-58939505894583408002021-10-16T15:20:17.693-07:002021-10-16T15:20:17.693-07:00Great measurements and reporting. Of course the la...Great measurements and reporting. Of course the last 2 meters of power cable to your equipment don't make any difference. If there is 20 meters of wiring to your breaker box, 200 meters to the power company transformer. I have even read about audiophiles who insist that the power cable must be "broken in" so it only starts to sound well after some hours of listening. Yeah right.jlinkelshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10048823531027789492noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-75388391397422932572021-10-04T07:16:09.666-07:002021-10-04T07:16:09.666-07:00So, if the last six feet are the most important, w...So, if the last six feet are the most important, why not upgrade all of the internal wiring in our components as well? Asking for a friend...SquireJimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14866819833386087736noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-47715687571063420952021-06-04T07:48:02.120-07:002021-06-04T07:48:02.120-07:00I agree - mostly. But I think you're forgetti...I agree - mostly. But I think you're forgetting a couple of very interesting aspects to the placebo effect. <br /><br />The effect is shown in this article with wine price being the variable (https://phys.org/news/2017-08-expensive-wine.html). The interesting bit (for me at least) is that there WAS a measurably different response in the brain ... the people did really enjoy the wine that Blackblade65https://www.blogger.com/profile/08294996677897327624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-5459227532814432882021-01-26T23:44:33.248-08:002021-01-26T23:44:33.248-08:00Well Gabriel is the Shunyata guy. Don't know t...Well Gabriel is the Shunyata guy. Don't know the specific figure you mentioned but he (the folks) have quite a few acronyms and claims around special technologies:<br />https://shunyata.com/technology-guide/<br /><br />Certainly even on that page we see all kinds of graphs on the microsecond scale and megahertz frequencies of questionable value to power cables and analogue audio!Archimagohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08642574001287787545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-60095128243795557712021-01-26T05:08:18.218-08:002021-01-26T05:08:18.218-08:00Caelin Gabriel of Shunyata
Is thus the same guy wi...Caelin Gabriel of Shunyata<br />Is thus the same guy with the patent which has a figure at a frequency 10 times higher than that stated in the text, something along the lines of a speaker cable having a different response at 100 kHz (like it matters) but the figure indicates the measurement was a 1MHz?Ellingtjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01728134818103703158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-69688885011911897662020-09-28T17:52:02.885-07:002020-09-28T17:52:02.885-07:00It would be very interesting to see some time/impu...It would be very interesting to see some time/impulse related measurements too, and possibly with some more highly regarded/known cables.Mourningstarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17449862948616395200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-57638368653438310052020-04-15T11:07:16.261-07:002020-04-15T11:07:16.261-07:00This thread needs a filter...a spam filter ;>This thread needs a filter...a spam filter ;> StevenShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08457350132948312910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-60527158402586197062020-04-02T06:33:10.824-07:002020-04-02T06:33:10.824-07:00Knowing very little about electricity (black magic...Knowing very little about electricity (black magic) I find this all very interesting. What are your thoughts on line conditioners and surge suppressors? I would like to avoid them if I can, but am being sold on clean power and not blowing up my hear.Mschut70https://www.blogger.com/profile/15296707937227547560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-69303604172998420062020-03-23T13:13:01.126-07:002020-03-23T13:13:01.126-07:00Actually some cable companies do provide white pap...Actually some cable companies do provide white papers for supporting their claims. E.g. https://www.qed.co.uk/downloads/qed/soundofscience.pdf<br /><br />I tried reading it, but am not an ee so didn't understand most of it. Archimago might.schnesimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444474344388893514noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4781727111866727703.post-66553224472767081412020-02-18T15:07:34.720-08:002020-02-18T15:07:34.720-08:00Hmmm, Will, if I did that, shouldn't a ~$3000 ...Hmmm, <em>Will</em>, if I did that, shouldn't a ~$3000 line conditioner like that make power cable differences even <em>less</em> significant?!Archimagohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08642574001287787545noreply@blogger.com