Monday 1 August 2022

Pacific Audio Fest 2022 (PAF 2022) - Concluding observations and thoughts... (MoFi One-Step DSD controversy, and a few videos!)

Well, the first PAF 2022 is now in the record books (see Day 1 and Day 2 for context). I honestly hope that the organizers, companies showing off their goods, and attendees all had a great time. I regret not getting the RMAF2019 T-shirt so made sure to grab one this time around and will wear it with pride among fellow audiophiles. ;-)

As I was driving home to Vancouver, BC, I was thinking about audio shows in general and also specifically about the PAF... What was seen, the experience of these shows as an audiophile, stuff like that.

After having attended a few of these shows now, I personally think they're worthwhile as hobbyists. I'm tempted to use the word "pilgrimage" but of course as a "more objective" guy, this word would denote excessive reverence I think!

No, it's more of an opportunity to socialize for an audiophile hobby that tends to be much more of an individual affair. Guys sitting in their favourite chair after work, glued to the sweet-spot, imagining a sonic scenery, as in the PAF booklet above "Close your eyes... You are there..." I think shows like the PAF give us an actual physical nexus (plenty of virtual forums these days, right?) to mingle with other passionate hobbyists of all flavours; a "tribe" of many "clans". As I've suggested over the years, even if we might have heated arguments online, I think to meet in person over a nice meal and a beverage of choice will settle nerves and more likely than not promote friendships.

2022 as a start-up year I suspect is a tough one for any audio show. We are still in the pandemic and every week I hear of family members and friends testing positive. While thankfully the strains are not as virulent as previous waves, and with decent vaccination rates, no doubt many in the older age demographic or with health concerns probably would not be keen to get out and hang with others in small hotel rooms. It'll be interesting to hear of turnout numbers if PAF publishes the data; hopefully encouraging for future shows.

In this post, let's talk about a few items I thought about on that drive home...

I. About the PAF itself:

While the hotel itself is older and smaller than the rather grand Gaylord Rockies in Denver for RMAF, I thought it was good for the more intimate, smaller show like this. No large crowds, there wasn't a lineup in the hotel hallways. Yeah, the front desk seemed a little understaffed and the elevators were slow, but I thought things went quite smoothly as a show goer.

Signage and the itinerary book were well done by the crew. $20/day and $30/multiday is a good price IMO and the $12/day parking (conference discounted) is great! The staff were floating around and courteous, easily identified in their shirts. Really nice work.

The online web presence was fine and I had no issues with signing up and getting my confirmation E-mail of attendance. Use of the yellow/red wrist elastic was nice and easy for attendees. Industry and staff had name tags to help identify them and made them easier to spot.

II. About the seminar sessions:

Let's spend some time on this one as I often don't hear much discussion about these over the years.

The venue in the Maxi's Lounge on the 14th floor was comfortable and indeed "intimate". However I don't know if it was intentional, but I didn't see any projectors for a visual presentation. The seminars were literally the presenters talking into a microphone. I attended 4 of the seminars and I think some visual aids would have been nice.

For example, the session with Andrew Jones on loudspeaker design was just screaming for some pictures! When he was discussing the gated measurement technique, explaining direct vs. reflected sounds, crossovers and phase change, or even just a discussion on the importance of frequency response and whether "time coherent" hardware designs made a difference, I suspect many in the audience would have benefitted from such visuals. There's definitely a kick-ass presentation to be had there from a respected and experienced name among audiophiles!

My favourite session was the one with audio engineers Jim Anderson and Ulrike Schwarz moderated by Michael Fremer. It's nice I think for audiophiles to interact with those on the production side to appreciate the work that goes into albums, the decisions made, the "culture" from which the music we love arise from. Perfectionistic audiophiles (should) share much in common with those who seek to achieve high quality audio engineering in the end product. If you've talked to folks in audio engineering, you'll know that discussions about switch mode vs. linear power supplies, esoteric power cables, audiophile fuses, network ethernet switches will not go far. Seriously audiophiles, these folks make a living off the sound they achieve. If magic interconnects, and a few feet of power cables really made a remarkable difference and "opened up the recording", they would have happily incorporated the magic already! There would be way more discussions of audiophile cable brands within pro audio.

Anyhow, the fun part about this talk was the juxtaposition of the engineers and Fremer's viewpoints and of course advocacy of vinyl. Nobody said vinyl doesn't sound good, but it's very clear that the audio engineers believe:

1. Vinyl cannot replicate the actual sound of the hi-res digital master. (Inevitably adds its own coloring to the audio.) 
2. No such thing as analogue-to-analogue copy without significant losses. A major reason of course for production work to center around the "lossless" nature of digital.
3. Since ProTools matured with high resolution, they moved on from analogue (tape) to record, mix, and master albums. In 2002, ProTools | HD was released and I believe it was Jim Anderson who said that from this point on, all his work switched over and there was no looking back to analogue.
4. DSD recording (which some audiophiles somehow believe as the "Holy Grail" of digital) can be fine if you just want to archive something. But impossible to effectively edit, change levels, or add processing still these days. They used DXD (24/352.8) for the album Clique! and are happy to dither/resample/convert to other PCM or DSD variants as needed. 
5. Recognition that loudness-war mastering is no way for a good audio engineer to "build a career" even if for now, ultra-loud and compressed albums might be what certain people expect. This is good to hear and I do hope that in the days ahead, the discipline might change for the better in this regard. Engineers might be able to look back at their work as a portfolio with pride.
Nice to hear no-nonsense talk! While Fremer's general line of questioning and jokes about digital being "perfect sound" provided an invitation towards a certain idealistic stance on analogue and vinyl, it was good that the engineers presented well reasoned answers to remain digital for highest quality audio. 

Fremer dropped the joke about catching the "worst strain of COVID" - "COVID-MQA". I think this was the only mention of MQA by name that I heard at the show.

I also went to the talk by Qobuz "Chief Evangelist" David Solomon titled "All About Streaming". Well, I don't think the digital streaming neophytes got any clear direction about streaming other than a discussion about signing up for a service like Qobuz after that one! Clearly, there needs to be a Streaming 101 talk that hits on the basics about computer audio, networks, and discussions about how to get something going at home! (I wrote on this a few years back - Part I, Part II - initially in response to a RMAF talk online with tons of misinformation.)

A few names like Audirvana software was hinted at as a good alternative to Roon (which some people did not catch). There was no mention of devices like ubiquitous Raspberry Pi on the hardware side. Again, this talk could have been much clearer and I suspect the flow more defined if there was an actual slide presentation to keep things on track, helping newcomers understand broadly the wide range of options. Even if the talk is defined as Qobuz-centric (rather than "All About Streaming"), a deeper, concrete discussion on this would have been way more useful. 

What I see is the problem here is that Solomon has an agenda. He wants to impress upon us just how impressive lossless is vs. high-bitrate MP3 (it isn't for the most part). Then he feels he needs to impress upon us that hi-res sounds much better (it isn't, depending on source recording). And then he needs to of course indicate Qobuz is the best which I would not dispute other than to say, please being it to Canada. Yeah, I think a simple, straightforward, honest talk about computer audio in a "HOW-TO" fashion will be helpful for many who are not tech-savvy or even likely to go online for their information.

Finally, there's this at times bizarre presentation from Dr. David Robinson - Editor-In-Chief of Positive Feedback Online:

While it's titled "Past, Present and Future Audio Trends", all I heard was a focus on the past and hesitancy about the future! It's good that he's interested in multichannel, however he seemed a bit vague about discussions on specific stuff like Atmos. The topic suggests at least a detailed discussion on the past like previous audio formats but I didn't hear much of that either; would have been interesting to trace the evolution from wax cylinders all the way to modern hi-res digital. And then there's his odd fixation about DSD256 ("Quad DSD") as being some kind of magical bitrate/format, even at one point suggesting results of an A/B listening test (volume controlled to 0.1dB) where people listening to DSD256 preferring it to the actual master!? (Even if this is so, is subjective preference necessarily better quality or higher fidelity? Who would these listeners be? What DAC was used? How was DSD processed, with which modulator and settings for example?)

What's going on here? This is the level of understanding and discussion from an Editor-In-Chief? This is how audiophiles are being "educated" by the press? No wonder as a hobby there's so much misunderstanding and snake oil!

I did a quick search and found Robinson's recent post on a "hot-rodded Apple TV 4K" with stuff about Furutech CAT8 ethernet cable, claims that this mod ($2500) with a linear power supply somehow resulted in "Absolutely the most amazing video playback that I've ever seen in our home theater/surround room!", improving "from 720p to 4K", even "dramatically", even from YouTube. Remember, we're talking about an AppleTV 4K (around US$200 for the larger 64GB option) with digital HDMI output!

So what kind of doctorate does this guy have!?

Bottom line: I think there's much educational potential here for audiophiles. I suspect that commercial interests would not like an open discussion about not needing to spend big money on expensive cables, tweaks, DACs, or sinking $$$ into streamers and computers these days that are otherwise bitperfect. As an audio show however, I hope there's an ability to recognize that to be honest with consumers and showgoers, they need to make sure to allow discussions that are free of obvious bias. It's fine to make sales in the marketplace and within each of the rooms, but maybe allow the seminars to be independent of the commercialism and let invited speakers try to be as neutral and objective as possible. Otherwise there's a real tendency to end up cultivating strange beliefs in a stagnant echo chamber.

The audience questions in these sessions were very good and on-point. I think also the presenters should have given time to deeper discussions based on these comments.

III. About MQA

Actually there was really nothing here at the show about MQA. Maybe because Qobuz was a major sponsor. There were a number of booths using TIDAL as the streaming platform and some DACs can decode it of course.

It looks like basically just a checkbox item these days and there was obviously no excitement about it. Didn't see anyone asking about it or any salesperson bring it up as a feature of their device nor even visible logos. Dave Solomon mentioned that TIDAL has this "master" format and could "white glove" remasters in his talk, but didn't even use the three letters. I think MQA's done (with multiple reasons to let it die).

IV. Controversies and the Grapevine - "MoFi-Gate"

Being among audiophiles and engaging with some of the discussions provided an interesting opportunity to listen to and explore the controversies currently out there.

The "talk of the town" over the weekend appeared to be "MoFi-Gate". Here's a video if you (like myself before the show) have no idea what this is about:


Apparently the MoFi "Ultradisc One-Step" LPs have now been revealed (direct link) to have gone through a digital DSD256 intermediate from the master tapes, which the LP copies are being subsequently reproduced since 2015 (likely before 2010).

From my perspective, DSD256 is a better technology with greater fidelity retention than any analogue format out there. As such, to make an LP from DSD256 digitized from an original master tape would be completely transparent and would absolutely make sense. And for the vinyl audiophiles to not be able to detect a problem for years as in the video, is the expected outcome to this kind of clean mastering chain.

I guess the issue really is whether the LP buyer feels he/she was being lied to about the provenance of the vinyl product. What I hear when I watch that video is a man who's a collector, also perhaps making claims when selling to collectors, upset that maybe knowing this information affects the monetary value of the collection and its uniqueness going forward. There's clearly a special emotional attachment towards that ideal of a pure analogue chain - not just for the sound quality itself. I appreciate his passion, even if I think what MoFi did resulted in a better product for the thousands of copies they end up selling!

I think digital audiophiles would love to get their hands on these DSD256 intermediate masters MoFi made before they got transferred to vinyl! Now that would be awesome fidelity for many of these classics!

Clearly, MoFi has a PR issue currently which they should resolve.


To end this summary post of sorts, let's show videos! ;-)

Speaking of "one step" LPs, while I was visiting the Parasound / Dr. Feickert / KEF room, Michael Fremer came in with Malachi Lui to show off some music. This first video is playback of a lacquer of Hank Mobley's "Remember" (from Soul Station, 1960) in 45rpm:


Even though I'm not much of a vinyl guy, I've got to admit that was impressive sounding, clearly better than typical LP. As close to the master tapes as one can get spinning an analogue disc I think.

Thanks to Michael Fremer for bringing this rare opportunity for us to listen! [Michael/Malachi, if you're reading this and think I should remove the videos, let me know. You just walked in at a providential time when I was sitting up front and had the "cameras rolling".]

And here's Malachi Lui introducing a selection from a Spiritualized album ("Shine A Light" from Lazer Guided Melodies, 1992):


Guys, I know that on Analog Planet, Malachi got quite a bit of flak for his reviews (perhaps not unjustified given the kind of attitude/language used at times). But just listening to his introduction here, I think we can appreciate that he's got passion for the music; something I hope we all recognize in our own journeys as music lovers, maybe especially when we were younger men. Whether we enjoy the genres or artists, music appreciation is always subjective, so let's make sure we see it from that perspective, acknowledging evolution in tastes and culture over time. I think it would be very good - actually essential - to have younger members in this hobby. The demographic remains vastly older males at the show as you can see in the images above (most of the ladies seem like wives or girlfriends with their dude) although it's very nice to see some younger listeners especially in the headphone area.

Regardless of whether we may be more objective or subjective leaning, I think there's room to be inclusive (so long as we all try our best to stick to facts and avoid snake oil, right?). Good luck to Michael Fremer and Malachi Lui with the upcoming Tracking Angle site.

By the way, we see Andrew Jones briefly, sitting to the right of me in the video above taking in the demo.

Finally, a quick video from the High End by OZ / United Home Audio room with reel-to-reel playback:


Apologies that the sound pick-up isn't the greatest on the camera at this volume, but that sounded amazing in the room that day. (Music is Rolling Stones "Moonlight Mile" from Sticky Fingers.)

As you can see, this too is part of the "audio fest" experience. One gets to see interesting gear, hear some interesting music, and meet some interesting people - non virtually...

Wishing all the best to the Pacific Audio Fest organizers and much success in the years to come.

30 comments:

  1. Good stuff. I really enjoy audio shows - that Wild West factor of hearing out of the box thinking designs is part of the fun for me. Often an unconventional system will sound too odd. But occasionally I hear some astonishing sound. And it's fun to gear kick generally speaker. I agree very much that it's an opportunity for a pretty solitary hobby to become more social!

    Thanks for the videos too!

    I actually enjoy watching videos from audio shows, especially if someone has used a decent microphone. Audiophile Junky usually uploads tons of different videos from audio shows of systems playing.

    Of course you can't really evaluate the sound that way. But it can still be really intriguing. I go through the videos on my home theater system - projection-based with surround sound (Hales speakers), in an all blacked out room.

    So all I see in front of me is a super clear, dimensional image of "walking in to a room" at a show, and sitting down in front of a pair of speakers playing. The visual sensation has a sort of "being there" impact. Then with a big surround system, upscaling the sound, the main direct sound is kept front, with the room reverb cues mostly sent subtly to the surrounds. The overall effect is a bit of uncanny "being there" feeling, where it just sounds and looks like I'm entering different rooms, with different speakers, and the sound changes similar to what you get from the real experience. Again, certainly can't be used to evaluate sound per se, but there certainly are changes to be heard in the sonic character of each room/system, and when you can't be there, it's a fun alternative.

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    1. Hey Vaal,
      Sounds like a nice set-up you have there to virtually create that A/V experience ;-).

      Yeah, audio show videos do leave a lot of quality out; impossible of course to capture the full experience of actually being there. Even if one could, YouTube would just compress it down to whatever they want to stream anyways!

      Regarding evaluating the sound at audio shows and making conclusions, yeah, that's impossible as well given the nature of the rooms and could be very different in our own homes. Furthermore, there are all kinds of folks walking around, chatting, sounds from other adjacent rooms, etc. You can hear that in my videos as well.

      Nonetheless, I think we can still get an idea of how something sounds. At least point out equipment we might want to for sure evaluate at home! And I guess we can hang out with members of our hobby "tribe" even if we have many "subtribes" in the midst. ;-)

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  2. Thanks for all this coverage of the show, Archimago! It's definitely more "down to Earth" compared to Sterephile's reports.

    I think, it's good to attend trade shows if you want to check out the look and feel of products. However, for educational purposes it's much more productive to attend professional of DIY gatherings: AES conferences, NAMM, ALTI Expo, and my favorite one: The Burning Amp (https://burningampfestival.com/). You can check the videos from the last online event here: https://burningampfestival.com/videos/, zero snake oil added :)

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    1. Hey Mikhail,
      Glad you liked the coverage.

      Over the years visiting these shows and reading the magazine coverage, I figured that most of the time, it's just a little bit of fluff anyways. Fun to show the pictures (audio eye-candy) so audiophiles can see how systems were set up and the matching that these companies do when they put them together. It's good to show some new gear and interesting products that may be worth keeping an eye on (like the Zidoo NEO Alpha 4K A/V streamer).

      Once awhile I guess one can be blown away by the sound, but I don't think that's typical given the rooms and ambient noise assuming one has a pretty good system at home already. It's certainly disappointing though when the sound really falls short and you question what's the problem in that system/room. Of course at no time over the years have I been impressed by the fancy cabling or tweaks to ever say - "Wow, those ***** cables blew me away!"

      I didn't see any scheduled cable demos in Seattle, and I didn't see guys like Ted Denney hocking his wares. Perhaps that's a good sign.

      The other thing I enjoy at shows is to just listen to the demo music they use! Which is why I make it a point to list the music in my posts so others might want to listen to something new that companies might have thought showed off their system. We always have the typical female vocals like say Melody Gardot (didn't hear Diana Krall at all!) or classic rock like Pink Floyd. The Michel Jonasz track is a new one to me this year as was Ben Harper's "Fight For Your Mind".

      Those Burning Amp videos are very cool. Thanks for the link! Indeed, zero snake oil. I think part of the fun in engaging with the broader audiophile culture is because it is so anomalous. As such, I think "rational audiophiles" can be a vocal subgroup who can have meaningful impact in that culture to advocate for change. That potential for change is part of the fun I think!

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    2. Thanks a lot for a detailed reply! Good point about the choice of recordings. I'm now going again through your notes and checking the songs you mentioned. It's always nice to discover more well engineered albums beyond Pink Floyd and Steely Dan :)

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  3. Wait, you're a Doctor?? I play one on TV, but all this time I thought you were an engineer. Anyway, you missed a great opportunity to ask Fremer/Anderson et al why they still want to convey music in 2 channels, like Clément Ader did. In 1881.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereophonic_sound
    Btw, glad you enjoyed the luddite 2ch bling show, they can be fun!

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    1. Hey there AJ,
      Yeah, couldn't get into engineering so settled on med school instead. I think there are a number of us unfortunate souls out there in the audiophile world. ;-|

      On a serious note, medicine is a mix of art and science which is I think also essential when we think about music content and audio hardware. To lean too much on one side to the exclusion of the other is to veer into extremes. As much as it is important to quantify performance, I do appreciate the importance of subjectivity as well when it comes to preferences. Over the years, I think this has been something I've been drawn to as an audiophile. The importance of bringing "balance to the Force". Why I talk about these debates and the psychology also that underlies some of our beliefs and desires within the "audiophile culture".

      Actually, Clique! is available in 5.1 and they did talk about multichannel at one point in the discussions. There was mention about the fact that this was an acoustic recording so base channels were all that was needed (no need for stuff like Atmos objects). There was a joke made about Dolby updating the Atmos software "every Thursday" (something to that effect) suggesting that there's still ongoing refinement in the background. I recall there was also the mention of using Auro3D but was whispering with someone at the back around then and might have missed some details.

      While the show only offered 2-CH hardware and rooms, the discussions and questions certainly reflected interest in multichannel within the attendees. I should have asked David Solomon about their library of MCH in Qobuz. Alas, since I don't have Qobuz here in Canada (boo!), I unfortunately cannot check it out directly...

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    2. Hah, that wasn't a put down, just didn't realize until now. Yeah, I know medicine involves science. Seriously.
      Cool, see now they spoke of MCH.
      Clique! 5.1?? Omg, Nooo...;-). Haven't played an MCH SACD in forever, but hopefully the ".1" is defeatable in setup menu. You could have schooled them on why (Soundfields Acoustics vs Hearing, begin at pg 34) https://www.linkwitzlab.com/Recording/acoustics-hearing.htm
      Then again I've never met and audiophile or studiophile who can begin to comprehend that presentation. Btw, no mention of MQA? You didn't catch that the CD layer of Clique! is...ummm...MQA?
      Oh well, one day Amazon Music might stream Atmos for something other than a stupid Alexa, though given the proven track record of studio idiocy when doing "surround" mixes, not expecting much. Till then, there's always good upmixing (like Linkwitz proposed). Yet another thing the luddites can't comprehend ;-).

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    3. Absolutely did not read it as a put down at all AJ :-). I think over the years there have been many of us doctors writing audiophile stuff!

      I'll have to check out the MCH Clique! and whether that .1 was put to use; might not have much signal in that channel. Yuck, CD version/layer MQA. Didn't realize that until you mentioned. Good then that Fremer made a joke about MQA in front of the engineers!

      Interesting slide set. Good read. Yeah, lots to be done in terms of accurate reproduction correlated to the soundfield; hopefully we're bit by bit getting there...

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    4. Yeah I'm tempted cause I have SACD capability on at least 3 dusty machines, but $35-40 to play back a 14 bit CD if you don't, oye!

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    5. Yeah, MQA-CD is totally nuts and IMO out of the question as an audiophile.

      Other than the SACD, another option that might make sense is the digital download. For example the NativeDSD DXD 2.0 and 5.1 (24/352.8) download for me here in Canada is CAD$43 total which works out to about US$35.

      https://www.nativedsd.com/product/imp7002dxd-clique/

      Since it was produced in DXD, I would assume that this would be literally the "master" quality, better than having gone through DSD64 encoding. Assuming of course the record label handed over the "real deal" to NativeDSD for sale...

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  4. Thanks for the informative and (as usual) insightful reports from PAF. I do agree, audio shows provide mostly an opportunity to socialize. Occasionally, I've been surprised at how great something can sound in a hotel room.
    My main question to you is about COVID. You pointed out: "We are still in the pandemic and every week I hear of family members and friends testing positive. While thankfully the strains are not as virulent as previous waves, and with decent vaccination rates, no doubt many in the older age demographic or with health concerns probably would not be keen to get out and hang with others in small hotel rooms." I am in that demographic and skipped the show for that reason, although I live in Portland (a great area for audio dealers). In your photos, there's not a mask to be seen. As an M.D., do you have concerns about that?

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    1. Hey Roth,
      Well, I for one wore a mask through the whole show but I was certainly in the minority because I think it is important to "practice what we preach"; especially since I'm in and out of the hospital all day long and would not want to inadvertently spread anything down there among fellow audio-people.

      My hope is that all attendees recognized the risks. Thankfully, even though the strains are highly infectious these days, likelihood of severe illness is much lower. Vast majority of folks may have nasty symptoms (many will also be asymptomatic) for a few days but recover usually completely within less than a week.

      I think all we can do is to remain vigilant and good to others. For those with susceptibilities, keep an eye out for potential strain-specific vaccines in the autumn. I agree that life needs to go on and am glad to have enjoyed PAF this year...

      All the best and take care Roth in Portland.

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    2. Thanks, Arch. It's long covid I fear. Last estimate I saw was P of long covid given you had covid was about 0.20 -- not trivial! And no clarity on whether vaccination or case severity affects that. Glad you enjoyed the show. I may go to the next one in any case -- I'd like to see some people I will only see at audio shows.

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    3. Hey Roth,
      Yeah, "long COVID" (or PASC - Post Acute Sequelae of COVID-19) is a thing and currently still not well understood. Thankfully not all persistent symptoms severe... Alas, lots of probabilities one needs to keep in mind!

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  5. Thanks for the show reports, Arch. I like show reports but I'm always skeptical when it's from the press. I prefer non "professional" reports. I was almost a little disappointed about your Salk impressions. I'm going to be in the market for speakers soon and I'm strongly considering the BePure 2 as well as the Song 3 beat. I wanted rave reviews! Seriously, though, thanks for the great reports. I now have a few more brands to consider.

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    1. Hey Hogues,
      I'm honestly not sure I can give "rave reviews" over anything I hear at an audio show given the limitations of the rooms and the inevitable folks walking by and chatter!

      Realize that I'm not much of a tube amp guy nor into NOS DACs which I believe is the combo they hooked the speakers to. As I recall, I thought it sounded quite neutral which is perhaps as good a complement as I can give at these get-togethers! Certainly back to the land of "good sound" after the previous room I attended.

      Obviously make sure to have a listen yourself at the dealership or home trial. Intellectually & technically, the combination of Purifi drivers with the Be tweeter should be a nice combo for those speakers I was listening to.

      BTW, make sure you like the look of the Purifi drivers with their ruffled-looking surround. There was a little note as you walked into the room telling folks that it's supposed to look like that and the cone was in fact not damaged! I think it looks fine but I would happily put a grille in front for the esthetics.

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    2. @Hogues - I am no expert in the Salk speakers, but I would advise you to be cautious. I heard Salks in two rooms at AXPONA 2019, and in both cases, I heard a "cupped hands" coloration. A friend has a pair, also; those sounded nice if rather markedly rolled off, though I can't say (in any of the cases, really) if it was speakers or the setup. Salk is an expert woodworker, and the speakers are beautiful looking. As with any speaker, I would not buy unless I could have a no-obligation home audition. I hope you have fun and wind up with speakers you love.

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    3. Thanks for the info, guys, I appreciate it. On another topic, I'm interested in the roon alternatives that you mentioned. I am using JRiver right now and Roon just seems too expensive so any alternatives would be great.

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    4. Thanks for the comment Roth,
      Indeed, home trial is the only way to go with one's equipment in one's room!

      Hogues: I've personally only used JRiver and Logitech Media Server to any significant extent other than Roon.

      I know that some folks like Audirvana and I see that these days they've split into a subscription-based Studio version which includes streaming integration with TIDAL, Qobuz, and HiResAudio, and a one-time Origin purchase which is meant for local libraries.

      Many like the Audirvana interface and it has DSP capabilities like Roon as well. Some people comment on it "sounding better" although I'd just caution claims about sound quality if the software is just sending bit-perfect data to the DAC unless proven otherwise (like in the old days people used to talk more about uncompressed AIFF/WAV sounding better than lossless compression like FLAC ;-).

      Other software like Foobar, various DLNA server software, etc. can also perform server duties with remote control via tablets and smartphones to your streamer hardware...

      It's stuff like this that I wished David Solomon could have expanded on in his talk. :-)

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    5. @Hogues - To help people offer suggestions, perhaps you could say what you find lacking in JRiver. Having used it for 10 yrs, I consider it a capable Swiss Army knife of digital audio. The main shortcomings in my view are lack of integration with streaming services and an idiosyncratic interface. Also, its documentation is poor. Though I update JR every couple of years, I've switched to Roon in everyday use, for its better interface that is uniform across systems, tons of metadata, etc. But it is more costly (and not just on the software end), and its search is rather disappointing for classical music.

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    6. Absolutely, Roth, but you pretty much hit the nail on the head. The main thing is the lack of streaming integration and the clunky interface. For my work system it's great. No wifi here so I have my music on a HDD and have repurposed an old surface and it works perfectly for what I need. Roon had a much better interface with better metadata integration, liner notes and the endpoints normally just work. But it is expensive and I'm not sure that it is worth it to me since I mostly listen to records, which I is clearly @Archimago 's favorite medium. JRiver and Roon have some of the same functions but are in two different categories, IMHO. JRiver is great for all around media use, especially for HTPC's, while Roon is focused only on music.

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  6. Nice report.
    MOFI: The whole thing cracks me up. All the vinyl fanatics who seem never to understand that about 99% of .vinyl produced is either sourced from a digital master, or if not, it undergoes a digital stage at some point in the production process of the LP. MOFI totally isn't unique in this regard (although they may have been deceptive).
    Anyway, there's a stubborn refusal to acknowledge that if you have vinyl that's sourced at some point from a digital file, any "analog goodness" you are hearing vs digital playback is merely euphonic (to you) distortion.
    If you prefer it, great. Just don't tell us that it's higher fidelity to the source or "more real".
    I personally would prefer good digital playback of the digital source.
    As far as NativeDSD, they are one of the few places that's totally transparent about how their material is sourced. They tell you on each album page.
    They have a small number of "pure DSD" albums - recorded in DSD and never leaves the DSD format. Mostly small classical or jazz ensemble recordings that don't need traditional mixing. They also have a few albums sourced from tape and converted directly to DSD for sales.
    They have a number of albums recorded in DSD 256 or DXD. But they mostly master them in 32 bit DXD and then convert that to download formats: anything from 24/96 to 24/384 and DSD 64 to 512 DSD.
    Occasionally they have an album recorded in DXD and mastered in 32bit DXD and they even offer a copy of that actual master for download.
    The theoretical (as far as sound goes) advantage of this system is that you can buy the actual master format - or something very close to it - if you prefer the "least adulterated" format for playback.

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    1. Thanks for the note Unknown (Danny?),
      Yeah, that's good to see that companies provide provenance information as transparently as possible. Sometimes, even the actual "studio master" might be in something like 192kHz but when you look in an audio editor, it still looks like the audio must have been sourced from a lower resolution, maybe at some point gone through an analogue phase so there's low-level noise.

      To me that "analog goodness" comment and how some prefer that sound is what the engineers acknowledged. Conversion to an LP inevitably adds a certain "character" that of course can be "euphonic". ;-)

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    2. Explaining MoFi gate to non audiophiles, I tell people there is this company that lied about the quality of their product, where the actual quality was better than they claimed, and people are upset about it.

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  7. -- "Anyway, there's a stubborn refusal to acknowledge that if you have vinyl that's sourced at some point from a digital file, any "analog goodness" you are hearing vs digital playback is merely euphonic (to you) distortion. " --

    As someone who can prefer vinyl playback sometimes, I certainly don't dispute that. I've seen many audiophiles in to vinyl acknowledge it as well.
    Of course there are some who do make bad arguments for the superiority of vinyl.

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    1. Indeed Vaal,

      I have no qualms with vinyl sounding great and enjoy the collecting (hoarding) myself. ;-)

      Just don't go nuts about how LP/analog resolution is "infinite", or that it's "closer to the master", or somehow necessarily, qualitatively superior to digital as some kind of truism.

      In general, playback of a good digital master sounds better to me; doesn't add noise, is free from clicks and pops due to physical anomalies (warps, off center, scratches, or just dust/gunk in grooves), is way more stable in the time domain (DAC jitter is nothing compared to stuff like LP wow & flutter!), has less risk of distortion (especially stuff like inner groove anomalies, fluctuations in sound quality depending on where the track located on the disc), low bass sounds more authoritative and spacious in digital, and of course digital does not degrade over numerous playbacks.

      I trust that many of those items are just statements of facts even if ultimately preference is subjective to each! And those are just sound quality items... Don't forget about increasing costs or even whether in this day and age we should be producing relatively frail plastic products that can be easily rendered almost unusable if we accidentally drop it or put a deep scratch through the grooves!

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  8. I was at the Qobuz presentation. Would’ve liked to have met you! Maybe next time.

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    1. Indeed, maybe next time Frans!

      Hope you enjoyed the show...

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  9. Ciao "Mago"..Greetings from Verona - Italy
    Despite available time and the Media are completely focused on our useless Government Crisis caused by "The Right" and the upcoming elections in which they think (and probably will succeed) to channel and collect Protest and Discontent Votes of electorate maiority ( of those going to vote ... we are less and less!), still a few minutes to read the Good Friends. !!!
    As you imagine, happy for MQA "disappearance" ... what is this..!?. a new, just discovered aminoacid...!?
    And..Mo-Fi gate...
    I'm not passionate about it at all. As you know I am not an Expert Technician, but as a common Music Lover, my basic good sense tells me that the transition to Digital is not automatically a "Damage" and as in all technologies of this world, more than the type of technology itself, is fundamental the QUALITY with which they are used i, which directly affects the Suppory Quality.. (Vinyl or CD).
    Ciao and .. Peru '..? .🤔. have you Japanese Relatives ..!? 🤗
    Buona Vita..🌈
    Maurizio

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