REVIEW: MeLE Quieter3Q (Celeron N5105, 8GB DDR4, 256GB eMMC) MiniPC: Fanless, 4K/HDR streaming. Getting closer! (Thoughts on Apple's M1 Mini as HTPC.)

Yeah, that's an old XBOX 360 Kinect camera back there! Hey, there are cool things you can do with this as a 3D scanner...

Greetings ladies and gents. In the posts for both the MeLE Quieter2Q post as well as just last week with the Beelink SER4 Ryzen 7 4700U computer review (BTW, I added an addendum - HDR10 works on that machine), I noticed questions, comments, and E-mails about utilization of these MiniPCs in the home theater setting; specifically video and HDR features.

Recently, I saw the availability of the MeLE Quieter3Q fanless MiniPC (currently around US$250). With the various feature upgrades, I figure that this is one which might qualify as a reasonable HTPC computer given that it features HDR video capabilities and a bit more CPU processing power. As such, I decided to take it for a spin. I bought the slightly more expensive 256GB eMMC storage model; since I am targeting video playback, it might be nice to have some extra storage for local data.

Much of what I said about the Quieter2Q applies here, so let's focus on performance differences and discuss this machine as a video streamer beyond audio purposes...

I. Hardware

For completeness, there's your open-box shot. Contents are basically identical to the Quieter2Q. The power supply is a similar 12V/2A USB-C switching unit. There's a VESA mount with some screws in the plastic bag top right.

As with the Quieter2Q, notice the presence of a micro-SD slot for some (slower) extra storage in the rear. Internally there's also an M.2 2280 NVMe connector to add even more, very fast, storage. Something like a 2TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus is advertised to be compatible and might make for a fast, compact, audio/movie library.
Notice the little CMOS Reset pinhole button between the HDMI ports if you ever mess up the BIOS!

Likewise, front and rear of the machine look identical. Of course make sure to peel off the stickers to improve heat dissipation before running. It can get quite warm so air flow is important wherever you put it.

One tip to consider - attach some stick-on "feet" underneath to provide a larger gap below the unit if you're going to be using it on a tabletop. You see this in the top picture elevated a bit as a result of some stick-on vinyl footers. This machine can get pretty warm underneath so let it breathe a little down below!

The other update to the package is the internal wireless module, now WiFi 6 (802.11ax) and Bluetooth 5.2 capable.

An interesting finding in the CNX Review of this unit is that the right front 2 USB ports are actually faster USB3.1 ("Gen 2", 10Gbps), and the backmost USB  port on the right and rear are slower USB3.0 (or USB 3.1 "Gen 1", 5Gbps). Good to be aware of this if plugging in fast USB devices like external hard drives capable of 10Gbps.

The final (and important for our discussion) port difference to be mindful of is that those HDMI outputs are now 2.0a - capable of HDR.

II. Stock Performance

The Q3Q has upgraded the RAM architecture to 8GB of "low power", single-channel LPDDR4X-2933. The quad-core Intel "Jasper Lake" 10nm Celeron N5105 is a 10th Gen design over the Q2Q's "Goldmont Plus" Celeron J4125. Here's the CPU-Z identification of CPU and motherboard:

Unfortunately CPU-Z was unable to identify the RAM and there were no SPD timing parameters it could show.

Let's compare speed then with some AIDA64 Extreme 6.70 results along with my other computers as I had done last week (all at stock power/speed) :

Memory Tests:           Read (MB/s)    Write (MB/s)   Copy (MB/s)    Latency (ns)

MeLE Quieter3Q N5105     16959           22453          19042          66.9

MeLE Quieter2Q J4125     10409           10631          12860          93.5

Beelink Ryzen 7 4700U    36173           35510          29360          99.8

Intel NUC 6i5SYH         32161           45606          36301          66.1

Intel i7-7700K Server    31323           33913          31512          61.9

AMD Ryzen 9 3900X        49044           45780          46165          77.1

CPU Speed (Int): CPU Queen  PhotoWorxx(MPx/s)   ZLib(MB/s)  AES(MB/s)    SHA3(MB/s)

MeLE Q3Q N5105    20157       8640               144.5        15822        431

MeLE Q2Q J4125    19156       6771               120.4        9301         365

Beelink 4700U     49409       20336              422.8        48864        1534

NUC 6i5SYH        18092       15463              119.3        6101         553

i7-7700K Server   54240       20647              392.4        20509        1874

Ryzen 9 3900X     124348      29694              1191.3       107024       3705

CPU Speed (FP):   Julia    Mandel    SinJulia    Ray-Trace(kRay/s)    FP64 Ray-Trace

MeLE Q3Q N5105    5604     2974      1003        1034                 533

MeLE Q2Q J4125    5835     3179      1112        933                  499

Beelink 4700U     50212    27457     8003        8750                 4870

NUC 6i5SYH        11358    6126      1603        2417                 1352

i7-7700K Server   38236    20577     5422        8160                 4505

Ryzen 9 3900X     113102   59539     20537       21413                11413

As you can see, in stock configuration, the Q3Q is a step above the Q2Q in all areas of memory and integer CPU performance. Interestingly, floating point processing was a mixed bag. Notice that for the first 3 of the FP tests - Julia, Mandel, SinJulia - the previous Q2Q was actually a little faster. Unless there's something in the BIOS hampering performance, it looks like Intel might not have improved the FPU performance as much in this next generation Celeron, preferring to favour integer speed which makes sense since low-power machines like these will likely not be performing massive number-crunching.

We can benchmark the stock machine against other N5105's out there as well using UserBenchmark which I think is a reasonable way to look at day-to-day performance:

Not bad. The MeLE Quieter3Q machine competes well with other N5105's at 66%ile CPU and 76%ile iGPU speed which suggests a good fanless package with component synergy. The memory module is identified as a Hynix LPDDR4 and at 98%ile performance is phenomenal. With a unified memory system, that likely helped push the graphics speed forward compared to other similar machines.

Having said this, graphics speed here is nothing impressive at 4.2%ile overall compared to most computers out there (remember, this is compared with all kinds of discrete 3D graphics cards!), the Beelink SER4 last week got 14%ile with its integrated AMD iGPU. 4%ile is however a significant improvement over the Quieter2Q's Celeron J4125 which clocks in at just 1.8%ile. The N5105's performance advantage is thanks to the faster iGPU core speed, as well as double the shader and execution units at 192 and 24 respectively. As with the previous generation, hardware graphics decoding includes H.265, H.264, VP9, VP8, AVC, and JPEG.

The data isn't complete above in that UserBenchmark could not detect the eMMC storage. So here are the CrystalDiskMark results:

Clearly, the internal eMMC is slower than modern M.2 drives that can hit gigabyte/s read and write speeds, or even SATA III SSD. This is more akin to something like a previous-generation SATA II SSD such as the old 120GB OCZ Vertex 2 I slipped in the Ryzen 7 computer last week:

Circa 2012 SATA-II SSD - the OCZ Vertex 2 powered by the notorious Sandforce SF-1222 controller!

Notice how the eMMC struggles a bit with random reads and writes. In use as a music/video player, this is still fine for reasonably snappy booting and opening of apps and files.

III. "Underpowering" Settings for the AV Room

Since this machine could be living in an AV room and running 24/7 as a multichannel-capable Roon endpoint, let's see what we can do to underclock/undervolt (basically just "underpowering") this to maintain lower energy consumption while still providing good processing speed. Note that I'll be approaching this from a "good enough" perspective for my needs. There are numerous choices one can make depending on desired power/performance among the copious BIOS settings.

Before I begin, here's a look at the Windows 11 HDR settings:

Nice. Indeed, this little machine is capable of HDR10 output. Connected to a HDCP 2.2 receiver, we can fully use and stream HDR video content. Windows' Auto HDR feature is also available although obviously things like gaming will need to be at most "casual", low 3D hardware demand titles.

For me, since the intent here is to upgrade from the Quieter2Q, let's see about achieving similar low power utilization, my standard being a maximum 6-8W setting for the CPU, aiming for <10W for the total system would be nice.

This MeLE BIOS is very open and the tweaker can find countless options to play with. Beyond the basic power level adjustments, there are also settings for voltage shifts (including FIVR [Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator] settings), fine tuning of the iGPU core speed, etc. Anyhow, let's just play with the CPU Power Levels (PL) as we did with the Q2Q:

Notice the unit for PL is in mW with 1/8W (125mW) increments as noted in the info panel top right.

And with this little tweaks, let's run the AIDA64 benchmarks again:

Memory Tests:        Read (MB/s)    Write (MB/s)   Copy (MB/s)    Latency (ns)

MeLE Q3Q (6-8W)       16865           22636          18644          66.3

MeLE Q3Q (stock)      16959           22453          19042          66.9

MeLE Q2Q (6-8W)       10399           10623          12721          92.3

MeLE Q2Q (stock)      10409           10631          12860          93.5

CPU Speed (Int):  CPU Queen  PhotoWorxx(MPx/s)   ZLib(MB/s)  AES(MB/s)    SHA3(MB/s)

MeLE Q3Q (6-8W)   18345       6639               118.7        12777        349

MeLE Q3Q (stock)  20157       8640               144.5        15822        431

MeLE Q2Q (6-8W)   16723       6296               92.2         7572         298

MeLE Q2Q (stock)  19156       6771               120.4        9301         365

CPU Speed (FP):   Julia    Mandel    SinJulia    Ray-Trace(kRay/s)    FP64 Ray-Trace

MeLE Q3Q (6-8W)   4406     2346      860         842                  456

MeLE Q3Q (stock)  5604     2974      1003        1034                 533

MeLE Q2Q (6-8W)   4729     2576      906         732                  412

MeLE Q2Q (stock)  5835     3179      1112        933                  499

We can see the proportionate change in speed by dropping the power envelope for the Quieter3Q - about 10-20% reduction. This is about the same with the older QuieterQ2. Notice also the same pattern, some of the floating point benchmarks were a little better with the Q2Q, while Ray-Trace results still favouring the Q3Q.

As expected, underpowering the CPU will not affect the memory speed significantly since we're not touching the RAM.

Something I noticed with the Q3Q is that while I reduced the CPU power level, the Kill-A-Watt meter is not showing as much reduction in total wattage as when I modified the Q2Q. Whereas the Quieter2Q will barely show 10W spikes for the total system, I'll see the Q3Q go up to 14W or so briefly; my suspicion is that the enhanced iGPU is using more power here comparatively so there are other BIOS parameters to look into if one wants to further reduce total consumption. As such, the Quieter3Q still runs a bit warmer than the Q2Q.

IV. Use as AV Player in Home Theater

Okay, with some understanding of the raw CPU performance, let's have a look at this fanless computer in the home theater room. Refer to the previous post regarding multichannel audio and Roon since the same set-up applies. As I showed above, this machine is capable of HDR video output. Also, I made sure to set the Windows 11 Display to 4K/60fps.

I've been using free K-Lite Codec Pack for years and the included Media Player Classic. Download the "full" pack if you also want to play with stuff like the MadVR renderer (like for high quality anime upscaling). While installing, you can also set the HDMI bitstream settings. This computer is able to pass lossless Dolby TrueHD-Atmos streams to the AV receiver:

With that, we can play Spider-Man: No Way Home UHD-BluRay rip - H.265/HEVC codec 4K/23.976fps/HDR10/Dolby TrueHD-Atmos streamed over my home network to see how well it performs:

It looks great in person. Notice that it's not perfect as you can see in the yellow bottom left highlighted area that there were 15 dropped frames across a total of 2241 drawn - that's 15 frames over 93 seconds or 0.7% which is not noticeable.

And for confirmation of the audio output to the receiver:

Yup, the Yamaha receiver is indeed seeing a lossless TrueHD-Atmos 48kHz stream and playing it as 5.1.2 on my system. Notice the CPU and GPU utilization when playing the 4K/HDR video with CPU at only 8% (even when underclocked), and GPU 67%.

That relative difference between CPU and GPU performance is important because we can appreciate then the limitations here as a video player. Whereas Spider-Man is a 4K/24fps/HDR10 movie and it's fine, here's Gemini Man which is 4K/59.94fps/HDR10:

As you can see in the bottom, this is not looking good! 2121 frames drawn, and 3237 dropped; obviously jerky playback. Removing the underclocking ("underpowering") doesn't improve the situation to any significant extent because as the utilization data suggests, it's the GPU that's getting hammered.

[As an aside, high framerate (HFR) movies like Gemini Man are rare, generally unsuccessful and the "look" is understandably polarizing among viewers. With familiarity, I think I can overcome the "soap opera effect" feeling even if real 60fps and not interpolated, appreciating the quality. Unfortunately, I missed The Hobbit Trilogy in the cinemas but would love to check it out in 48fps if they ever released a 4K UHD-BluRay in that theatrical framerate! I wonder if over many years, with more true 48/60fps content, video buffs might become more accepting of the HFR content; perhaps like 2-channel audiophiles over time might accept more multichannel music...]

This general trend is seen with streaming off YouTube as well (VP9 codec rather than H.265/HEVC) although obviously Internet conditions will affect quality. Typically, I don't see any problems with 4K/30fps SDR streams like this Under Red Sea 4K video in Chrome with hardware acceleration on:

41/6635 dropped frames = 0.6% isn't noticeable. Generally with streaming, I think even up to 3% drops spread out evenly over time is fine although we aim for 0%. As you can see, at 30fps SDR, neither the CPU nor GPU appear stressed whatsoever.

But do not expect YouTube 4K/60fps HDR (Japan cherry blossoms 2022 example) to play smoothly:

Again, clearly this is too much for the little iGPU to handle - 1092 dropped frames out of 1588.

The main issue has to do with HDR. For example, here's a video with lower framerate at 4K/30fps/HDR (jellyfish):

Apologies for these HDR screen captures. The extra brightness which can be glaring for the eyes also strains the contrast quality in camera images...

As per the comments in red, we see that the GPU is hitting the 100% limit every few seconds in the 3D engine even at just 30fps; this is what's causing the dropped frames even though CPU and total GPU utilization may still be <100%.

The moment we turn off HDR, even 4K/60fps looks quite smooth with the Quieter3Q (Costa Rica video) with 117/8173 = 1.4% dropped frames - not perfect but still not that noticeable. The 3D engine load on the GPU dropping substantially back to 25% and total GPU utilization sits at 51% including video decode and processing components:

So there's a massive hit to rendering ability once you turn on the 10-bit HDR output.

Basically what we can say is that while this computer's HDMI output does feature HDR, be mindful of limitations and to not throw whatever 4K video file we want at it, expecting smooth playback all the time.

V. Summary

Notice how tiny this computer is compared to that Oppo UDP-205 it's sitting on!

Okay ladies and gents, this will probably be it for me and computer reviews for a little bit ;-). With the audio measurement computer updated as discussed last week (Beelink SER4), and today examining an option for a fanless home theater PC, I think I'm set for the next little while until maybe an even more powerful fanless HDR-capable computer comes my way.

As you can see, the MeLE Quieter3Q MiniPC (~US$250) with the Celeron N5105 CPU is generally a step up in performance over the Quieter2Q I talked about in February. For most tasks one might perform using a low-power machine like this, it feels faster; for example running web browsing, E-mails or even light duty Office tasks on a 4K/60 screen, this should be OK. Be mindful that the FPU hasn't completely superseded the Q2Q performance, so if you do complex DSP work, performance will be about the same. Likewise, no AVX2 instructions supported by this Celeron (again, for audiophiles, newer versions of Windows HQPlayer will not work for upsampling).

The main update with the Quieter3Q is in the area of video performance - HDR capability specifically - at the expense of a few more watts (~2-3W or so higher when playing video). As expected, more heat will be produced. I have not experienced any instabilities or slowdowns attributable to temperature in the AV room while watching videos with adequate space for airflow. 4K/60fps/SDR video streaming is a smoother experience with the Q3Q, while providing bitstreamed audio over HDMI including lossless Dolby TrueHD-Atmos. However, while 4K/HDR playback is fine with movies encoded in HEVC at 24fps (which is really the majority of titles), realize that for >30fps content, the iGPU does not appear to be powerful enough to comfortably maintain smooth HDR playback without dropping frames across the LAN. Likewise, internet video streaming like YouTube (VP9 codec) at 4K/30/HDR is not smooth enough for my liking; best to stick with SDR for YouTube and the like which I found to be still good at 4K/60/SDR.

These caveats are why in the title of this article, I'm suggesting that we're "Getting closer!" to what I would consider a mature fanless, inexpensive, x86 Windows-based, home theater PC. Perhaps in another generation or two (couple years?), we'll get there without any caveats about resolution, frame rates, or HDR in a silent package. Who knows, maybe by then 8K might be something we care about (IMO, doubtful due to human visual resolution limits - like how 16/44.1 is generally good enough given auditory limits).

When comparing the older MeLE Quieter2Q vs. Quieter3Q, my recommendation is that if all you need is HDMI audio streaming including multichannel output, want the lowest power utilization, and have no need for upgraded WiFi 6 or Bluetooth 5.2, then it's fine sticking with the MeLE Quieter2Q. If you want a better video subsystem, maybe dabble in some 4K/24-30fps/HDR playback across your LAN, and smoother 4K/60fps/SDR Internet streaming (and of course lossless Dolby TrueHD-Atmos, dts-X, etc...), then the Quieter3Q should be a satisfactory, inexpensive, fanless solution.

--------------------

How about the Apple M1 Mini as a home theater PC?

I've seen this question brought up a few times in the comments.

While I honestly believe many will be very happy if they go with the M1 Mini, let me explain why I haven't jumped at putting this machine at the top of my HTPC list, and a few opinionated words about Apple.

1. The M1 Mini is not fanless, and it's too powerful for the niche I'm looking to fill. I prefer a "distributed model" of home networked audio (and video) which means I have a central server computer elsewhere in my home to deposit terabytes of media whether it be home videos, movies, music albums, etc. accumulated over a lifetime.

I know the fan in the Mini is barely audible, so I believe it's fine; one just has to make sure in the sound room that it's not going to affect those "blacker black" silences between notes so it really depends on one's ambient noise level. I'm very picky with a preference for fanless devices when listening to music (and also no spinning hard drives) as an audiophile.

As for being too powerful, the "distributed model" means I only need lower-speed music and video players, hence devices like the Raspberry Pi make sense for 24/7 always-on streaming; this also makes sense from the perspective of energy costs and environmental stewardship as consumers. The Mac M1 Mini has enough processing power for productivity applications (like the Ryzen 7 MiniPC machine) so I feel its potential is being wasted by this machine just sitting in the AV room most of the time. I see it better suited as a server with multi-terabyte drives attached; not something I would want in the AV room unless space is very limited. Having said this, I do like the efficient ~7W idle low-energy consumption. Under load, the Mini M1 goes up to ~40W (as measured here) which is still good.

For me, the "Promised Land" would be to see a general purpose computer like this that can play 4K/60fps/HDR/lossless TrueHD-Atmos bitstream with no dropped frames, is fanless, and sips up to ~10W only in the near future. If you're a computer manufacturer, let me know if you make one of these!

Value of consumer products by definition also implies a price point. Do I want to put a US$700 M1 Mini (8GB, 256GB SSD) in the sound room mainly just to stream videos or 5.1 music over HDMI? I think we should be able to do this well at a lower price point.

2. For most HTPC AV playback, there are already "TV Boxes" that are more convenient and less expensive. I already have an AppleTV 4K which is set up and ready for my wife and family to use. The AppleTV is easier to use than a Mac, compatible with numerous iOS apps, designed to be very quiet (small internal fan which I'm willing to concede to when watching videos/movies), uses little power (something like <6W streaming 4K/HDR), and has a good remote control system with voice recognition.

Furthermore, video streaming is smooth with Gemini Man 4K/60fps/HDR movie and likewise no issues with YouTube 4K/60/HDR either with the AppleTV 4K (2021).

Having said this, obviously a general purpose computer will provide a level of flexibility that the AppleTV cannot. Once awhile it's nice to do some surfing on the 75" TV. Maybe compose a quick E-mail while also streaming multichannel music over HDMI.

3. Given the price and performance, the Mac M1 Mini can't do lossless TrueHD-Atmos bitstreaming! It doesn't even look like Atmos is supported as lossy E-AC3/DD+ bitstream. To make matters worse, the M1 Mini is reported to be limited to 24/48 through the HDMI output!

As an audio lover, these limitations are right up there with missing HDR video support in the home theater. Last year I was disappointed already that the AppleTV could not bitstream lossless TrueHD-Atmos (it gets decoded as multichannel PCM but will lose the discrete Atmos channels), but at least lossy EAC3-Atmos is passed through and that's all the quality we get from streaming services like Apple Music and their Spatial Audio.

However, if I pay $700+ for a Mac M1 Mini to put in the home theater, to not be able to play my own ripped 4K/HDR movies with TrueHD-Atmos through the home server, or even to use Apple Music to stream Spatial Audio to the HDMI receiver (which the US$200 AppleTV can), seems like a step back in features. As you see above, the little MeLE Quieter3Q, and Beelink SER4 last week both can do lossless Atmos bitstreaming in Windows with little drama (and 24/192 over HDMI is no problem).

In 2022, to be stuck with just 48kHz over HDMI, all audio needing to be resampled to this rate (including 44.1kHz material) feels archaic. Even previous Intel Mac Mini computers could output up to 192kHz.

4. Personal feelings about Apple...

Lastly, I used to have more Mac machines here at home (this is why I tested the audio out of various Apple laptops years ago) and I have no problems with using a Mac if I need to, they obviously will get work done just fine. These days, my wife still likes her iPhone, iPad, and MacBook Air M1 so I've maintained familiarity with the ecosystem. The hardware is often very good and the transition to desktop ARM from the ancient x86 CISC core has been long in coming; kudos to Apple for doing it in style! Having said this, as a user, there are OS choices made and issues with "freedoms" which I just don't like with the Apple-centric mentality. Some of these opinions are obviously a result of my tendency to be more of a "geek" than probably most Apple customers.

For example, I find the built-in apps like Apple Music (né iTunes) to be a pain. Because it's so integrated into the system and acts as a conduit for iOS devices like copying albums to the iPad/iPhone, this is more hassle than I care for. I would rather just copy and past audio files directly into the device like on Android. Furthermore, while I understand potential reasons why a codec like FLAC is not supported, again, the fact that Apple Music is so integrated into the ecosystem makes me miss the lack of support for what is IMO an otherwise ubiquitous, superior multi-platform file format compared to Apple's ALAC. [Even if imperfect, at least Microsoft has implemented native FLAC recognition in the OS since Windows 10 with their beta releases starting in 2014.]

This feeling of loss of freedom extends to the unnecessary limits which I think would be obvious for technology geeks. Lack of lossless TrueHD-Atmos bitstreaming is an example as discussed in item 3. This oversight is so obvious that it must be interpreted as a deliberate decision based on some kind of company intent. Is there some licensing issue here around not allowing higher resolution digital audio? Is there a DRM angle? Are they actively trying to dissuade people from using the M1 Mini as a hi-res audio player? Is this a not-subtle hint that the AppleTV/iOS is the only legitimate Apple hardware to be deployed in the living room? As usual, Apple remains silent and leaves us to ponder whether there is deeper "wisdom" in their ways...

Apple is very good at wrapping up technology with pretty esthetics, shaping trends in lifestyle tech, and of course the hype that inevitably comes with that. Beyond affecting technical evolution (not as much "revolutionary" as they often seem to claim), they're obviously great marketers and capitalists!

After all these years, the hype in those slick WWDC CGI-overwrought announcements about how "magical", "amazing", "incredible", developers using "their superpowers... to change the world", etc. can be a bit nauseating for me. There is an impressive marketing machine here that takes self-promotion to amazing heights and most importantly, makes money; certainly deserving to be studied in business schools even if some of the decisions might not be celebrated by more technically-minded users.

Alright, that's enough about Apple unless I bite the bullet and take the unlikely step of buying one of these M1 Mini boxes for a spin. ;-)

As usual, I hope you're all enjoying the music - and the movies!